AI infrared

(Sharon) #1

I recently bought some IR filters to attach to my camera (prior to committing to complete conversion) … the results were not very nice … and it got me to thinking that it should be possible with AI technology to create a product that would beautifully convert standard photos to high quality Infrared images … IAm I correct in thinkin that if the same scene could be shot with standard camera and with cameras set to different wavelengths (say 680nm, 720nm and 950nm) and this was done for a variety of scenes that AI would be able to extrapolate the same results to reproduce results for other photos.

Anyhow just a thought.

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(Dragonpainter) #2

I would also be interested to hear the answer to this one.

(Don) #3

You might have hit on the reason that it may be very difficult because IR (Conversions or Filters) restrict light below certain wavelengths and that light wavelengths are not part of the information retained in the image. But the good thing is you can simulate color infrared simply by using invert in a pixel editor (Studio included) … crude but basic … desaturate for B&W.

(Kenneth Kovach) #4

Excellent idea!
I like the shots I have seen of real ir photography, but have been reluctant to try try to modify my camera myself

(TERRY) #5

@ShazzyCo
There’s lots of ways of doing the conversion of the images. If you use a filter you will get the “IR” component mostly. The sensor of your camera will have a very wide range extending beyond the visible, so it has a set of built-in filters to cut the contribution from the IR and UV. This lowers the sensitivity of the WHOLE sensor, but of course cuts the IR recorded. So sticking more filters on the front of the lens cuts even more light. A “camera conversion” changes the filters covering the sensor, extending the sensitivity into the IR but radically changing the range recorded. That’s the only true IR photography. Having said that, your excursion into IR with a filter on the lens will achieve quite a good effect if you persevere with the image. There’s a lot of stuff out there on this type of post-processing but for mainly PhotoShop. You could try looking at Levels, Contrast etc. Often swapping the Red layer to Green etc can work. A B&W conversion with a tweak of the contributions from R G B Y M C components works. I have a old cellphone and two Fujifilm cameras which have yielded a number of workable images. My Sony cameras do not because the sensors carry heavy filtration and the image stabilised type are a little difficult to exchange. I’m told Canon sensors can be easily modified or even swapped because again the sensors are heavily filtered.

(Sharon) #6

@el48tel … I was just hoping that maybe AI technology could actually be used to achieve results without having to use filters or a converted camera.

@AiDon … I understand the basics of the process used for IR photography. I thought since AI was used for converting photos using AIRemix to resemble styles of artists that it would be possible to compare photos and there IR equivalents to then be applied to other images. I have managed to create a bit of a IR look preset in Studio but it isn’t fantastic … figured AI might be used to create better.

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(Artisan-West) #7

Sharon, I’ve decided to share my Topaz Studio Infrared simulation file by posting in Dropbox. You can do a lot of IR type looks using this in Topaz studio if you have the adjustments (not sure if the adjustment still works if you don’t own it). Here are some basic instructions though most of these are near correct already. https://www.dropbox.com/s/up9yjkes11mvus9/Infrared%20Simulation%202%20RL.tsp?dl=0

  1. Turn off AI clear if it is on, until you are finished.
  2. Adjust the color overlay color to get the look you want.
  3. Adjust the B&W adjustment to darken blues and lighten greens and yellows.
  4. adjust other layers as needed.

The file contains an example picture.

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(Sharon) #8

thank you @Artisan-West … nice of you to share - it looks great … I have a couple of presets I set up myself (not as good as yours though)… I was just offering up a suggestion of a possible product for the AI suite.

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(Tony) #9

Thanks for sharing @Artisan-West- opens up a whole new area of interest for me!

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(Jack) #10

I am willing to setup a shareable Dropbox where the community can share its TSP files until the Syncing Problem is solved…?
I have several TSP files to share.

Please signal your interest by just adding your name in response.

Thank you!
~Jack~

2 Likes
(Don) #11

Hi Jack,

Sounds good would certainly be interested and would be great for sharing.

Don.

(Tony) #12

Yes, please!

Thanks

Tony

(Jack) #13

If you would PM me your email addresses, I can then add you to the Dropbox access list.

The folder at Dropbox is named Topaz Studio Project Files - each included user may download and upload files.
My starter TSP file is named RostamiLynx. It might be an idea to name your TSP files to include the uploader’s identity, although it’s not essential.

(Flick) #14

Thanks for the tsp file, Ron (@Artisan-West) - very nicely done. Also thanks to Jack (@Torcello) for his offer to set up a Dropbox account to exchange such files.

(Jack) #15

The Dropbox is up and running - just PM me your email address - and you can begin downloading/uploading right away!
Currently we have 2 x TSP files uploaded - one by @Mond=BigCat (shimmering reflections and voluptuous clouds), one a direct lift of a technique by Greg Rostami (RostamiLynx).

(ScottO) #16

One primary reason software isn’t a true solution, is that it can’t tell the difference between plants and non-plants. Software will, for example, apply the IR effect to a green car or building as well as green plants because it doesn’t have the complete picture when it comes to spectral components of green paint versus a living green plant. (giving myself the thumbs up for that pun :+1:)

IR photography can be used to study variations in vegetation because it not only sees living green and inanimate green differently, it also sees a difference between things like grass, trees, crops, soil, moisture content, etc. As an example, this enables farmers and the US Department of Agriculture to monitor crop health, moisture and compliance based on their respective spectra.

I think software can make nice IR-like images, but I would think it very difficult to make truly accurate conversions.

In addition to the effect of sensor filters, IR wavelengths are different enough from visible light to affect focus. One often gets soft images when using an on-the-lens IR filter; so you may need to make adjustments for that. Many lenses have IR adjustment marks on the focus ring. Even if you do a camera conversion, this is still an issue because the lenses and focus system are designed for visible light.

Best regards

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(Ricci) #17

Thank you @Artisan-West for sharing you fantastic preset with us.

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(TERRY) #18

You can make a false IR composite just like those from the Ektachrome IR colour film. You make a normal colour image and you lose the blue layer in the old image – and then promote the red layer in the old image to become the green layer in the new image – and then promote the green layer in the old image to become the blue layer in the new image. As a separate shot you take an IR filtered image from which you lose the blue and green layers — the red layer becomes the red layer in the new image you are building — tried it – it does work but my results need some fine tuning!

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(Artisan-West) #19

There are usually different reasons for doing IR photography. Most typical photographers are doing it for artistic reasons but it is expensive and getting a camera conversion often means it will only do IR, though I have heard of full spectrum conversions. A simulation costs nothing if you have the software like Topaz but is very hard to look realistic (though not 100% accurate).

I spent probably 25 hours of experimenting to find a new sim that can work on most pictures for the artistic IR look. Topaz adjustments allow it to look good but of course simulation is not for scientific purposes. I think it would be hard to use AI for this purpose since it has to recognize living vs non living things and things that absorb/radiate heat (as you pointed out). Might be done but probably not be worth it for artistic effects.

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(Artisan-West) #20

I would suggest that anyone creating a tsp file for sharing, first reduce the picture size to about 1500 pixels on longest side. This will keep the upload and download size smaller.

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