So i take it that, in my case where it’s usually digitized files @480, to do the necessary deinterlace, noise reduction first, and then when uoscaling apply sharpen?
Everything I’ve mentioned recently assumes we are already working with deinterlaced input. However, sharpening at original size can be problematic. Being that you’re working at the same pixel width and height, attempting to sharpen at original is sure to flatten something. The best solution is getting the adjusting for better (more) detail preferentially over denoising. So crank up detail enough so you get a clearer image, detail-wise, and the push up the denoise just enough to avoid eroding detail.
Next, you need to check to see that detail isn’t so high that it overdoes it and begins to ‘fake’ recognition. If so, crank denoise and detail down a little to see if you can get the optimum result.
In regard to deinterlacing: Deinterlacing is an important subject all by itself. Some of the most basic problems there are the various interlacing methods used, including the hacks for making the media compatible with the playback hardware in use at the time. - There is no single be-all and end-all solution for deinterlacing video. But one of the biggest problems is that the video was actually interlaced before it was compressed into am MPEG video format. That means that any good deinterlacing methodology should also be able to do decompression and noise reduction before the actual deinterlacing process should be started. - Unfortunately, you will not find many of these. The end result is that a lot of noise gets ‘baked’ into the deinterlaced video. - Interpolation can help remediate this problem somewhat, but that is also problematic.
This subject should get better treatment in another thread. - There already is one, but I think it may be getting out of date in term of TVAI’s capabilities in the deinterlace area.
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pd white, do you mean pushing up denoise above relative? To be honest, i have a hard time to beat Auto… Does that relative -100 mean bypass that function or even invert it? Cheers!
will try some more two steps.
In Relative mode, by default everything is set to ‘auto.’ You will see this as “0” on each control’s line. Reducing or increasing the value biases the auto behavior. For example: Increasing denoise by five make the denoise part of the Proteus algorithm work harder.
If memory serves the extra setting is a ‘bias’; changing it just elevates (or lowers) the response curve for that auto setting.
And, setting a control to -100, may not turn it off. But you can try it and see.
I know that the deblur setting is best at the middle unless you like jumpy frames or anti-alising.
The main problem is turning too many settings too high. Doing so can push the other settings off balance. - So easy does it. Never push, unless you like surprises… 
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Thank you. Great info.
I cannot get relative to auto to pick a value for Anti-alias/Deblur that doesn’t create fake details, so I’ve been using manual.
You are totally right about going easy on any value change and some values countering other values!
I don’t have the patience right now to try multiple passes. For now, using the methods you have explained in this topic, I have at least got a very grainy old video to be upscaled and not be grainy. It’s still just as blurry with a little loss of detail, but I’m pleased with it. The far off faces don’t look creepy and it doesn’t look like a painting. Most importantly, it looks better than a simple Lanzcos filter upscale.
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Good. to hear you’re having some success.
FYI: There are some on-line tutorials that explain the controls. - While they do describe specifically what the function is for each control, they don’t go very deeply into an explanation of how it is used, and rarely it’s relationship to the other settings.
I suppose their expectation is that you’re going to use your own technique for using them or you already know what they know. - The latter problem is not uncommon in technical documentation; which usually renders most of the information useless.
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lol - if you disagree do the same. I have posted benchmarks several times on here.
Have you?
Sorry to interrupt Michael, but I just got back onto the Forum today after a long absence.
The reply/comment from you was just a reply back to your own user name.
Please clue me in on what’s happening.
Hi everyone!
I’m back from a long vaycay. And I just downloaded the latest TVAI 3x Beta. I used it to build a sequence of enhancement steps starting with a horrible fragment of a TV show (poorly) copied from an old VHS tape. While this example doesn’t give you ‘perfect’ results, I’m going to post it step-by-step in 15-second fragments.
I’ll need a couple of days to redo it. - I forgot that I was writing to AV1 and a lot of our forum readers won’t be able to view them or reuse them. So, I’m doing a do over with the same settings output to a more universally readable format.
FYI: Had some very good fortune on my trip. There may be a Z790 coming in my near future. 
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would be nice when you post your guide also to include your preset file you are using.
I’m planning to work this one up this afternoon. (That is, if I don’t get too many honey do requests, before I get to work on it. - In any case, I should be able to get to it in the next couple of days.)
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Addendum: I will be adding comments to each step.
(Also, If I don’t explicitly include them in my comments, using MediaInfo on each output file will reveal the settings that TVAI used in creating the output file. They are easily found in the file header file.)
I haven’t finished my documentation yet. I want to post the entire process as a single entry. Barring other issues, (including health), I expect that I’ll be posting it in the near future.
Also, FYI: I will be using the latest TVAI Beta 3.1.5.0.b. It has evolved into a very stable platform with some refinement of various controls… - However, I think these examples can still be reproduced in the latest released version using the same settings.
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Did you go to Las Vegas?
Nope. Casino on a cruise…
As a ‘free’ bonus, they gave me a W2 for the IRS…
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Addendum: I am replying to my own comment as the situation has changed. Using the newest beta of TVAI, it appears that Proteus is doing a much better job of scrubbing up noise (which also improves detail) by default than is had back when it made my previous comment.( As such, it is becoming necessary to only use Proteus relative mode to tamp down any noise that exceeds Proteus’s default noise reduction level. Or, perhaps kicking decompression up a bit may suffice. In any case, do not increase sharpening until you are rescaling. Sharpening without increasing the image size will actually tend to erode the detail.
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what version you using/referring to, which this statement is for if I might ask?
the latest as of writing this comment is v3.1.7.
you mentioned “the newest Beta”, what version of Beta we talking about?
I made this comment when using beta release v3.1.8.0.b. It appears to have a augmented version of Proteus that already does some of the things I recommended in the (first) 100%-100% denoise step. And it appears to do a very good job. - This means that Proteus should be run in the first denoise/detail at original size in the ‘vanilla’ Auto mode. (I’m certain there will be exceptions depending on the source video.)
The only downside is that it is much slower, but the results are very food. (FYI: I am outputting directly to AV1 (Nvidia) so the frame rate may differ for output in other CODECS, but i suspect the slower processing is due to image analysis and correction rather than output format.
And I expect they will most likely optimize this functionality and upp the framerate
v3.1.8 was just released, can you confirm that “the good vanilla settings” also applicable for the release version?
what about the second pass? also vanilla would be sufficient?
Not really. Assuming you have already done the 100% cleanup, your second pass (when enlarging image) should likely be enhanced by moderate relative to auto corrections. However, since we are resizing in stages, this should not be settings that will represent the final sharp, clear image until we achieve the target size.
In the above scenario, remember, practice makes perfect and it appears that Proteus may be starting to do a lot of this work for us. - If proteus could (eventually) contrive a way to do this resizing and enhancement by stages internally while allowing us to preview the final result or the process, it might be possible to do a ‘perfect’ enhance and resize in one swell foop.- I’m certain the processing time would be much greater, but ideally it might be well worth the wait. - But right now that’s just pie in the sky,
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